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APNIC 23 » Minutes » AMM

Minutes for the AMM

Friday 1 March 2007, International Convention Centre, Bali, Indonesia

Meeting commenced: 09:00

Contents

  1. Welcome
  2. APNIC new organisational structure
  3. APNIC member survey report and next steps
  4. Services Area
  5. Technical Area
  6. Communications Area
  7. Financial reports
  8. EC report
  9. AfriNIC
  10. ARIN
  11. LACNIC
  12. RIPE NCC
  13. EC election procedure and speeches from candidates
  14. IANA report
  15. The Review of APNIC Voting System
  16. APNIC fee WG report and discussions
  17. NRO statistics report
  18. ecoAPNIC report
  19. Address Council report
  20. NRO report
  21. NIR SIG
  22. IPv6 technical SIG
  23. Routing SIG
  24. IX SIG
  25. Policy SIG
  26. Database SIG
  27. DNS operation SIG
  28. PKI BoF
  29. EC election result
  30. APNIC 24 host presentation
  31. Next meeting, thanks and closing

  1. Welcome

    Paul Wilson, APNIC

    The Chair opened the APNIC Member Meeting and explained the agenda. He thanked the Gold Sponsor, CNNIC, and Silver Sponsors JPNIC, KRNIC of NIDA and TWNIC. He then explained the agenda and voting procedures for the EC election. The Chair then invited suggestions for any additions to the agenda.

    The Chair suggested that the meeting would be more effective if participants could give their attention to the speakers, and avoid using laptops during the meeting.

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  2. APNIC new organisational structure

    Paul Wilson, APNIC

    The presenter reported on the APNIC staff restructure. He explained that as a result of the restructure APNIC was now divided into four Areas: Services, Communications, Technical and Business.

    He explained that further details about each of these four areas would be detailed in later reports.

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  3. APNIC member survey report and next steps

    Paul Wilson, APNIC

    The presenter reported on results from the 2006 member survey report. The survey was conducted by independent consultant John Earls, from KPMG.

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  4. Services Area

    Sanjaya, APNIC

    The presenter explained the new Services Area structure, which now consists of 4 Units, including Resource services, Member services, Training services, and Online Services. The presenter reported on the main unit functions.

    This presentation reported on 2006 highlights, and summarised proposed plans for each unit for 2007.

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  5. Technical Area

    Sanjaya, APNIC

    The presenter explained the new Technical Area structure, which now consists of 4 Units, including Network operations, Research and development, Security and Software engineering. The presenter reported on the main unit functions.

    This presentation reported on 2006 highlights, and summarised proposed plans for each unit for 2007.

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  6. Communications Area

    Gerard Ross, APNIC

    The presenter explained the new Communications Area structure, which now consists of 4 Units, including the Events Unit, Policy Unit, Documentation Unit, and Marketing and External Relations Unit. The presenter reported on the main unit functions.

    The presenter reported on 2006 highlights, and summarised proposed plans for each unit for 2007.

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  7. Financial reports

    Kuo-Wei Wu, APNIC EC Treasurer

    The presenter reported on the 2006 audit for the whole of APNIC, and the membership status for 2006. He reported that the APNIC 2006 operating profit was US$134 667.

    [Break 10:45 11:00]

    The Chair presented the 2007 APNIC budget, and discussed factors affecting the projected figures. It was noted that there would be an increase of around 20% in the budget for salaries in 2007.This increase resulted from inflationary increases (average 5%), and a small amount of new recruitment.

    The most important factor causing the increase was a comprehensive salary review, which found that many APNIC salaries paid were lower than market rates.

    The total projected increase in salaries and related expenses was around US$600 000.

    It was noted that a loss of almost US$500 000 was projected for 2007.

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  8. EC report

    Maemura Akinori, APNIC EC Chair

    This report summarised the role and recent activities of the APNIC EC. The presenter introduced the members of the Executive Council:

    Che-Hoo Cheng (Secretary)

    Kuo-Wei Wu (Treasurer)

    MH Billy Cheon

    Qian Hualin

    Ma Yan

    Vinh Ngo

    The presenter noted that four positions were up for election, and that the results would be announced at the meeting. Attendees were encouraged to use the online voting system.

    The presenter summarised noted the EC had held seven meetings since APNIC 22. These were primarily conducted via VoIP in order to save on costs, but it was noted that more face to face meetings may be required in future.

    The presenter discussed important issues such as the fee structure, Internet governance projects, fostering a good relationship between the EC and the AC, and NRO incorporation. The presenter also provided a brief budget overview for 2006 and 2007.

    It was noted that the EC had endorsed four policies that reached consensus at APNIC 22.

    The presenter thanked people who had participated in the member survey.

    Questions and discussion

    • It was asked how many EC members were connected with the NIRs. The presenter clarified the split was 4:3 between NIRs and other organisations within the community.

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  9. AfriNIC

    Hisham Rojoa, AfriNIC

    This presentation summarised AfriNIC's recent activities, policy developments, and resource status.

    The Chair presented a gift to the presenter.

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  10. ARIN

    Leslie Nobile, ARIN

    The presenter did not use slides for this presentation, but instead referred to a printed report which was distributed throughout the meeting room, and gave a verbal report. The presenter summarised ARIN's recent activities, policy developments, and resource status.

    The Chair presented a gift to the presenter.

    Questions and discussion

    • It was asked if there were allocated addresses in the ARIN region that were not being used, and, if so, what efforts were being made to reclaim them.The presenter responded that there were many legacy addresses, but currently there was no recovery effort as this would be decided by the membership. However, it was noted that the ARIN board of directors were very interested in this, and it was likely to be discussed at the next ARIN meeting.

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  11. LACNIC

    Ricardo Patara, LACNIC

    This presentation summarised LACNIC's recent activities, policy developments, and resource status.

    The Chair presented a gift to the presenter.

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  12. RIPE NCC

    Paul Rendek, RIPE NCC

    This presentation summarised RIPE NCC's recent activities, policy developments, and resource status.

    The Chair presented a gift to the presenter.

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  13. EC election procedure and speeches from candidates

    Paul Wilson, APNIC

    The Chair explained the EC election procedure. There were four vacant seats on the EC. The EC members whose seats were up for re-election were Kuo-Wei Wu, Moo-Ho Billy Cheon, Qian Hualin, and Ma Yan. The Chair noted the MyAPNIC online voting and proxy procedures that applied for this election. It was explained how to complete valid ballot papers, noted the voting entitlements, and stressed the deadline for return of ballots.

    The Chair then called on the nominees to address the meeting.

    Ming-Chen Liang, Kuo-Wei Wu, Billy Cheon, Ma Yan, Kusumba Sridhar, and Mao Wei all addressed the meeting in person, explaining their backgrounds and hopes to serve the community.

    Imtiaz Ahmed, Rishi Raj Dahal and Haikikur Rahman were not present.

    Jichen Thinley could not attend in person, so he provided a statement that was read at the meeting.

    Nick Hannaford was participating in the web cast and also supplied some slides which were shown at the meeting.

    The Chair called on volunteers to help scrutinise the election. It was noted that there were over 1400 paper ballots to count, so the online voting system did not appear to be replacing the paper system.

    [Break 12:30 14:00]

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  14. IANA report

    Leo Vegoda, IANA

    This presentation reported on IANA's current activities, service levels, and resource status.

    Questions and discussion

    • It was asked if ICANN or IANA had an activity on their agenda to verify the status of /8s, as different sources had different figures.The presenter responded that this was on his agenda, and he had been following up with RIRs. The presenter believed the RIRs were also working on this. It was noted that the presenter was working to improve the accuracy of all resource data.
    • It was noted by an audience member that over the past 6 to 9 months the registries had not been kept waiting for space, and that as far as the registries were concerned IANA was now functional.

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  15. The Review of APNIC Voting System

    Hyun-Joon Kwon, NIDA

    This presentation discussed a recent review of APNIC's voting system and by-laws. The presenter noted this review was prompted by the proposed new APNIC fee schedule, which could change voting rights afforded to different types of members.

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  16. APNIC fee WG report and discussions

    Randy Bush

    This presentation summarised the events of the fees working group session. The presenter noted that around 60 people attended the session, which featured presentations from various RIR and NIR representatives. The presenter suggested that people who were interested in fees should look at the full presentation archive for the session on the APNIC web site.

    Questions and discussion

    • It was clarified by Ming-Chen Liang that the '3-bit model' he presented was similar to the current model, but different to the 2-bit model proposed.
    • It was noted that after hearing from RIPE NCC and LACNIC that the door was open for discussion.
    • It was asked if there had been input from LIRs at the meeting. It was suggested that LIRs were subsidising NIRs.
    • It was suggested that it was true that there hadn't been an LIR meeting, but that if there had been LIRs would have also asked for LIR fees to be lowered. It was argued that as a community we have to do what is good for all of us. It was observed that non-NIR members do not co-ordinate well and that should be rectified.
    • It was suggested that NIR willingness to pay or not pay had been misrepresented.
    • It was argued that the role of NIRs was different to LIRs, and that NIRs did not seek to 'steal' from usual members.
    • A slide from the fees working group session was shown to illustrate the cost factors for IP address administration for NIRs compared to RIRs and LIRs.
    • It was argued that although it seemed in the APNIC proposal that LIRs were subsidising NIRs, it was more a 'wholesale' versus 'retail' problem and that NIRs had cheaper fees because they packaged a lot of services together and used additional funding of their own to support those services.
    • It was suggested that there should not be a situation of NIRs versus LIRs, and that the community should look at things differently. For example, issues such as aging memberships, and whether registries were in the business of space rental or providing services needed to be considered.
    • It was suggested that in order to reduce friction the discussion and process should become more transparent.
    • It was suggested that the tier system could be modified to be more granular in order to make the system more equitable.
    • It was noted that the concept of providing discounts to old members could create conflict between old resource holders and new resource holders.
    • The presenter asked how many people thought NIR members should pay the same as a non-NIR member.
    • It was suggested that we probably shouldn't care from an end-user perspective, but in terms of calculating across the region it should all be the same. Therefore, if the NIR chose not to pass on that cost it would be their business.
    • It was argued there was a problem with this because there was a big difference in cost outlays between different NIRs.
    • It was asked if developing economies should pay the same.
    • It was asked if NIRs all provided the same levels of service.
    • It was suggested that discussing differences between NIRs added confusion and that the discussion should be kept simple.
    • It was noted that the fees for NIRs were often regulated by local government bodies.
    • It was noted that local taxation systems could also impact heavily on NIRs.
    • It was noted that this would be a problem that everyone would need to take to their accounting and legal departments.
    • It was suggested that the IP community in general was very stable and less costly when compared to the domain name business, and that the community was arguing over 'small change'.
    • It was argued that APNIC does not only charge for IP resources but also for good services, and that APNIC should be allowed to change its structure.
    • It was argued that APNIC should be able to treat NIRs as a single member.

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  17. NRO statistics report

    Guangliang Pan, APNIC

    This presentation discussed the status of IPv4 address space usage and allocations by RIRs. It also provided an overview of global IPv6 allocations and AS number assignments.

    The NRO status report was prepared by the five RIRs and included data up to 31 December 2006. The presenter noted that this report would be updated every three months, and could be viewed on the NRO website.

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  18. ecoAPNIC report

    Nurani Nimpuno, APNIC

    The presenter described an internal, staff-driven project at the APNIC Secretariat. The presenter noted that the project aimed to reduce APNIC's ecological footprint and implement more environmentally sustainable work practices. The project reviewed travel, energy efficiency, recycling, waste reduction, and other issues which affected the environmental impact of the APNIC secretariat.

    [Break 15:30 pm 16:00]

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  19. Address Council report

    Kenny Huang, Address Council

    The presenter described the Address Council's role and composition and reported on its recent activities.

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  20. NRO report

    Paul Wilson (on behalf of Ray Plzak)

    This presentation summarised the NRO's current status, composition, activities and priorities, with an emphasis on its role in global Internet governance discussions.

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  21. NIR SIG

    Izumi Okutani

    The presenter explained the NIR SIG's role. It was noted that there were about 30 participants.

    The presenter reported on the SIG's three updates from NIRs and one informational presentation. It was noted there was no Chair or Co-Chair election at APNIC 23, so there would be an election at APNIC 24.

    The Chair presented the speaker with a gift.

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  22. IPv6 technical SIG

    Tomohiro Fujisaki

    This presentation explained the IPv6 technical SIG's role. It was noted that there were about 60 participants.

    The presenter reported on the SIG's five informational presentations and an explanation of the SIG guidelines. It was noted there was no Chair or Co-Chair election APNIC 23, so there would be an election at APNIC 24.

    The Chair presented the speaker with a gift.

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  23. Routing SIG

    Philip Smith

    The presenter explained that this SIG was held as part of APRICOTs general routing stream. It was noted that there were about 70 participants.

    The presenter reported on the SIG's three informational presentations and an explanation of the SIG guidelines draft document. It was noted that a SIG Co-Chair election had been held. The two new Co-chairs, Randy Bush and Tomoya Yoshida, were elected unopposed.

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  24. IX SIG

    Philip Smith

    The presenter explained that this SIG was held as part of the APRICOT interprovider relationships stream. It was noted that there were about 70 participants.

    The presenter reported on the SIG's three informational presentations and an explanation of the SIG guidelines draft document. It was noted that a SIG Chair election was held. The presenter had stepped down from the Chair position and refused to be re-nominated. Gaurab Raj Ubadhaya was elected unopposed, and would serve along with the Co-Chair Che-Hoo Cheng.

    The Chair presented the speaker with a gift.

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  25. Policy SIG

    Kenny Huang

    The presenter explained the Policy SIG's role and noted that there were about 85 participants in the first session and 80 participants in the second session, with a further nine participating via Jabber chat.

    The presenter reported on the SIG's seven informational presentations.

    There were six formal proposals presented at APNIC 23. No proposals reached consensus:

    [prop-042] Proposal to change IPv6 initial allocation criteria

    • Action pol-23-001 - Chair to refer [prop-042] Proposal to change IPv6 initial allocation criteria to mailing list for further discussion

    [prop-043] Proposal to remove reference002 to IPv6 policy document as an "interim" policy document

    • Action pol-23-002 - Chair to refer [prop-043] Proposal to remove reference to IPv6 policy document as an "interim" policy document to mailing list for further discussion

    [prop-044] Proposal to remove requirement to document need for multiple /48s assigned to a single end site

    • Abandoned

    [prop-045] Proposal to modify "end site" definition to allow end sites to receive IPv6 allocations

    • Abandoned

    [prop-046] IPv4 countdown policy proposal

    • Action pol-23-003 - Chair to refer [prop-046] IPv4 countdown policy proposal to mailing list for further discussion

    [prop-037] Deprecation of email updates for APNIC Registry and whois data

    • Action pol-23-004 - Chair to refer [prop-037] Deprecation of email updates for APNIC Registry and whois data to mailing list for further discussion

    The following proposal was presented for informational purposes only:

    [prop-047] eGLOP multicast address assignments

    • Action pol-23-005 - Marshall Eubanks to present [prop-047] eGLOP multicast address assignments as a formal proposal at APNIC 24

    Questions and discussion

    • It was noted that action item pol23001 would be referred to the main SIG mailing list for discussion to determine if the resource working group would be re-opened.

    The Chair presented the speaker with a gift.

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  26. Database SIG

    Xing Li

    The presenter explained the Database SIG's role and reported on the SIG's five informational presentations. It was noted that the former Co-Chair had resigned. Ching-Heng Ku had volunteered to take on the role, and there had been no objections. It was noted that there were no policy proposals, as they had been moved to the Policy SIG.

    Questions and discussion

    • It was suggested that the presenter look at the Internet Draft from July 1998, (by Tony Bates, Randy Bush, Tony Lee and another author) for further information about a project regarding using DNS records for representing routing information. It was also noted that this proposal had been dropped, as the authors decided that it was not a good idea.

    The Chair presented the speaker with a gift.

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  27. DNS operation SIG

    Edward Lewis

    The presenter explained the DNS SIG's role and noted that there were about 40 participants.

    The presenter reported on the SIG's nine informational presentations. It was noted that no proposals were presented. It was noted that the presenter was the new elected Chair, and the Co-Chair position remained vacant as there had been no nominations or volunteers.

    The Chair presented the speaker with a gift.

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  28. PKI BoF

    Geoff Huston

    The presenter explained the PKI BoF's role and noted there were approximately five participants.The presenter noted the main discussion, led by Dr Stephen Kemp, was about standards for formal certificate policy statements and certificate practice statements.

    The Chair presented the speaker with a gift.

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  29. APNIC Member Meeting open microphone

    Tim Gartside

    The presenter reported on his first impressions of the APNIC community. The presenter noted that he felt APNIC had a well-established community with quite a bit of infrastructure. The presenter spoke about the group dynamics and cultural behaviours, and asked participants to discuss his observations with other participants.

    Questions and discussion

    • The Chair thanked the presenter and noted that things may be done a little differently in one or two of the SIGs during the next meeting in New Delhi.

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  30. EC election result

    Paul Wilson

    The scrutineer reported that there were 4958 ticks in the boxes, representing 1400 ballot papers that took three hours to count. These were combined with the votes that were cast online. The four successful candidates were:

    • Ming Chen Liang with 846 votes
    • Kusumba Sridhar with 843 votes
    • Mao Wei with 730 votes
    • Kuo-Wei Wu with 681 votes

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  31. APNIC 24 host presentation

    Roopinder Singh Perhar, ISPAI

    The presenter invited the APNIC community to attend APNIC 24, to be held in conjunction with SANOG 10 from 29 August to 7 September 2007 at the Hotel Intercontinental in Delhi, India. The presenter also noted the city's attractions, and informed participants that an informational web site would soon be available.

    The presenter also summarised the ISPAI mission and role, and provided an overview of the Internet in India.

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  32. Next meeting, thanks and closing

    Paul Wilson

    The Chair announced that APNIC 24 would be held in New Delhi, India, and thanked ISPAI for bidding and congratulated them for on their success.

    The Chair then asked Nurani Numpino to draw the winners of the iPod draw. The first winner was Laisiasa Nakacia from Fintel, and the second winner was Ming- Cheng Liang.

    The Chair acknowledged the support of the meeting sponsors, CNNIC, a Gold sponsor, Afilias, a Gold sponsor for the social event, and JPNIC, KRNIC of NIDA and TWNIC who were all Silver sponsors.

    The Chair also thanked the volunteer trainers, stenocaptioners, and APJII, who hosted the APRICOT and APNIC meetings. The Chair thanked all participants who attended APNIC 23.

    The Chair issued an invitation to attend the informal closing dinner.

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    33. Meeting closed: 17:39

    Minuted by: Donna McLaren and Tina Bramley

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