1 https://conference.apnic.net/48/program/schedule/#/day/8/amm amm-2 DISCLAIMER: While every effort is made to capture a live speaker's words, it is possible at times that the transcript contains some errors or mistranslations. APNIC and Lloyd Michaux apologises for any inconvenience, but accepts no liability for any event or action resulting from the transcripts. ************ >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Welcome back, everyone. We are going to restart the second session of the APNIC Members Meeting. We are going to start with the report on the Policy SIG, so I could request our Policy SIG chair, Sumon. If Sumon is still doing the slidesness we'll move on to the next one. Is Billy here? As our Policy SIG chair is still working on the report, I will request Billy Cheon, the NIR SIG chair, to continue with his report. >>Billy MH Cheon: Good afternoon, everyone. My name is Billy Mooho Cheon. I'm with KISA, Korean Internet Security Agency. As a national registry, we get together here to discuss our collaborations and work for this meeting and 2 I'm very happy to deliver what we discussed during the NIR SIG session. We had a meeting, NIR SIG meeting Tuesday, it was 90 minutes meeting and before we had a meeting, we had an election. There was three candidates, but the current co-chair, Zhen Yu, elected n opposed and he will continue another two-year term. Then we had seven updates from all other NIRs. First one, CNNIC, updated by Zhen Yu. They have 1,300 members and 331,000 v4 address and 16,000 v6 address. It was noted that their IPv6 is deployed in multiple ways with rapidly growing users and traffic. Main activities were they had IP alliance conference in June in Beijing and they also provide IPv6 and RPKI training in July and November they will provide another training in Hangzhou. They plan to upgrade RPKI and Whois system by the end of this year. Next TWNIC update was delivered by Tim Wang and Wen Yu Chen. They have 282 members and they have 132,000 /24 v4 addresses and they have 2,500 /32 v6. One of leading countries in terms of IPv6 deployment. Their IPv6 user availability reached 39 per cent, which is 8th in global ranking. They had also 32nd TWNIC Open Policy Meeting in June and discussions here in APNIC policy and Cooperation SIG topics were discussed. 3 Also, they work with APNIC to deliver IPv6 training and also they provided ROA trainings for members. They plan to hold another IPv6 and RPKI trainings in the future. Third one was VNNIC update. They have 413 members and 15,000 /22 v4 addresses and 72 /32 v6 address and their v6 it was noted that their v6 deployment is driven by the government and the government set up IPv6 national plan in 2011 and they v6 adoption of 39 per cent in 2019. Also they provided public online services for the government agencies and they also collaborated with other organisations, other NIRs, with KISA they signed the MOU and also co-hosted business meeting with the Korean ICT companies in last month. Also they provide RPKI workshop with APNIC and JPNIC. Hosted VNIX NOG and KISA participated and delivered presentations and keynote speech and they will focus on promoting v6 and RPKI in this year. Next one was I made update about KISA, KRNIC update. We have 96 members and IPv4 address is we have 112M and 5,000 /32 v6 addresses. We still keeping stable management and the numbers compared with previous years stayed the same, because of saturated market in recent years. 4 Also, we provide fourth addition of Asia Pacific Internet Governance Academy. We invited about 20 students from Asia Pacific region and local, another 20 from Korea. We provided, we trained them about basic internet governance and IP and domain number resource internet address resources. Also, as I mentioned before, we signed with VNNIC and actually this year, KISA was very busy because of relocation to rural area in November, which is two months away. So I expect more work with the other NIRs after relocation, maybe next year. Next, JPNIC update was delivered by Hiroki Kawabata. Japan has 449 members. They have 132 million v4 addresses and 7,000 v6 /32 addresses. It was noted that there are the market is very active for IPv4 and AS number transfer inter-RIRs and as a leading country in IPv6 deployment, they provide seminars and information sharing throughout the year. Also, they working very hard about RPKI and it was presented that 96 resource certificates were created, issued and 393 ROAs are created. They had a JPNIC Open Policy Meeting and also outreach to the local community, to local different communities. Next one IDNIC, update by Yudha. They have 500 members and 22,000 /24 v4 addresses and they have about 5 22 million v6 addresses. They just launched resource a management system called MyIDNIC and also they presented some members implemented ROA and RPKI. They had Open Policy Meeting in June in North Sumatra and they are going to, they plan to provide RPKI and IPv6 training in Yogyakarta in August. Next IRINN update was made by Shubham. They have about 2,700 members and 11 million IPv4 addresses, 6 billion /56 v6 addresses. It was noted that they have a high IPv6 propagation with 55 per cent use ratio and 69 per cent readiness. Also they had OPM in July this year and members were briefed about APNIC policy proposals and technical development. Group photo. That's it. Thank you. APPLAUSE >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you, Billy. Thank you to all the NIRs as well for participating and being our partners. I see the Policy SIG chair back in the room. So let's do the Policy SIG report next. >>Sumon Ahmed Sabir: Good afternoon, everyone. So I'll present Policy SIG reports. We have two sessions today. Agenda started with general election. Thanks to Aftab 6 Siddiqui for being reelected. So just those who are new here, again this is the Policy SIG charter. We in the Policy SIG, we develop policies and procedures which relates to the management and use of internet address resources by APNIC, NIRs and ISPs within the Asia Pacific region. You can join the mailing list and here is the web address of the Policy SIG. As you all know, I'm Sumon Sabir, SIG chair. Along with Bertrand Cherrier and Ching-Heng Ku are the co-chairs in the Policy SIG and we are extremely supported by NRO NC/ASO AC, Aftab Siddiqui, Brajesh Jain and Simon Sohel Baroi The steps of implementation procedures, I won't go through in detail. You can take a look at the website. We don't have much time here. Then we go the implementation update, that the policy passed in the previous meetings. First which is prop-125, validation of abuse-mailbox and other IRT emails. This policy was passed in APNIC 46 and already in the implementation phase. Implementation is going on. Phase 2 starts in December 2019. In APNIC 47 we have prop-127, change maximum delegation size of 103/8 IPv4 address pool to a /23 from a /22. It is already implemented on 29 February 2019. 7 Prop-128, multihoming not required for ASN. This proposal also passed in APNIC 47 and it's already implemented in 2 July 2019. Prop-129, abolish waiting list for unmet IPv4 requests. Before that prop-128, it was there, but this policy actually abolishing the waiting list and it is also implemented on 2 July 2019. In last APNIC 47, we have discussed that we need to modify or update the Policy SIG Charter to include broader the scope. We have very nice discussion in the morning and officially we agreed to the Policy SIG charter develop policies which relate to the management of use of internet nub resources within the Asia Pacific region. This includes policies for resource allocation, recovery and transfer, and for resource registration within Whois, reverse DNS, RPKI and related services. This proposed SIG charter reached consensus in the Policy SIG meeting. We have discussed prop-124, clarification of IPv6 sub-assignments. It is quite a while in the mating list and discussed in the earlier meeting. In this meeting also didn't reach consensus. We have discussed prop-126, PDP update. Again, few changes in the PDP. But the support of it got support, but didn't reach consensus in the Policy SIG meeting as 8 a whole. We have discussed prop-130, modification of transfer policies. This policy didn't reach consensus again in the Policy SIG meeting. Prop-131, editorial changes in IPv6 policy. So it suggest some editorial changes in the policy. Intent to remove non necessary text and simplify the policy. It reached consensus in the Policy SIG meeting. The last proposal we've discussed prop-132, RPKI ROAs for unallocated and unassigned APNIC address space. It was earlier named as AS0 for bogons. We have lot of discussion on the mailing list on this proposal and discusses in the Policy SIG meeting in this morning. It reached consensus, but with some cautions about the implementation, how challenging it would be or something. So things to taken care of by the APNIC Secretariat, how they are going to implement. These three proposals actually SIG charter and prop-131 and prop-132 is up for consensus here, so I'll go with the SIG charter first. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Please go for the SIG charter. For those who are not paying attention in the morning discussion, one of our processes is that policies that go through the Policy SIG and reach consensus is called for consensus again at the Members 9 Meeting. So that's what we're going to do now. Obviously, the Policy SIG Chater is not its a policy, but it still follow the same process. So we're going to ask for consensus, that we approve this proposed new charter, new and improved charter for the Policy SIG in this meeting. So I would call for those who are against this policy, against this change of charter, to raise their hands. There seems to be no opposition. Those in support. Thank you. I think that kind of reaffirms what we saw this morning. So thank you SIG Chairs. I think we can say that this can be implemented tomorrow. So we'll have to figure out how this works, the SIG charter change, because whether it has to go through EC endorsement or not, but this has been -- I can the clear that this change of charter has reached consensus, so we move on to the next one. We reached consensus on this prop-131 in the Policy SIG. Prop--131, editorial changes in IPv6 policy. The policy mainly makes multiple editorial clarifications and changes to the IPv6 policy, allocation policy or assignment policy, because I think that's one of the 10 changes it had also. It reached consensus, so I'm going to re-call for consensus. Is there any opposition to this particular policy? None. Those in support, please raise your hands. Looks good. Thank you very much. I can say that this policy has reached consensus in the AMM. So we'll move forward. Prop-131. Next one is prop-132, which obviously was discussed earlier before lunch. RPKI ROAs for unallocated and unassigned APNIC address space. This proposal was initially proposed as AS0 for bogons. This policy reached consensus at the Policy SIG. I call for consensus here. Is there any opposition to this policy or comments? None? Those in support of this, moving forward? Thank you. Looks there's consensus and no opposition to this particular policy. So I can declare that this has reached consensus and can move forward. As for the other policies, what are the state? Are they proceeding ahead? >>Sumon Ahmed Sabir: Actually, I just bringing on discussion at the end of the Policy SIG that it has been proposed 11 that we can have a ... all the policy documents and relation between -- I think there's some gaps, so APNIC Secretariat take action that they can look at the whole overall all the documents and between them, because a lot of proposals we are seeing are coming out editorial changes and some of the text changes, all this thing, so probably it's time to review it again, so that can be -- in that case, probably we can avoid some of the proposals that are continuously coming and going to pass through. Some of the things are supporting, but part of it not supporting. Event I will the proposal not get passed, so I think we need to talk with the authors and we can decide about that and whether we will be dropping the proposals or will be the mailing list again. >>Sunny Chendi: There's a slight confusion. That's why I'm standing here to clarify. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: I think what I would say is rather than try to discuss the process here, I think I agree that we talked about doing an overhaul of our policies -- our policy documents, not the policy. Sorry about that. >>Sunny Chendi: Exactly, thanks. >>Sumon Ahmed Sabir: Sorry for the misleading text. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Editorial and bringing it align, 12 because the way our policy works is we go and make piecemeal changes and after a while, the whole thing looks like Frankenstein, for the lack of a better word. So we need to clean that up and I think that is an effort we can start. I'll let the SIG chairs confer with the authors and decide on the next course of action, but I think the right thing would be to move forward the clean up. Thank you Sumon. Thank you Bertrand. Thank you Ching-Heng, all the SIG Chairs. And thank you for all the work. Thank you to Jordi and Aftab for the proposals and exciting discussions. APPLAUSE >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: We go to the next one which is going to be the report from the Cooperation SIG, joy. >>Joy Chan: Good afternoon, everyone. And welcome. I am as the first time chair for the Cooperation SIG. I want to say thank you very much for having me serving this great with honour on this road and for this Cooperation SIG happened two days ago on the 10th, the very first thing at the specific place for the first meeting. These are the people I want to give my sincere and honest appreciation. It's without them this Cooperation SIG will not be able to carry so successfully. So at the very beginning time by the invitation to working 13 with them on the content and to really stimulate everybody's thoughts, coming to this new thing we are carrying on this Cooperation SIG is to internet and jurisdiction. This is not an easy topic to tackle, but we certainly did it with a lot of the efforts from the team and as well as from the APNIC staff support. The thing is on internet jurisdiction as I said there's many subtopics that we can carry out and with various discussions some could be very controversial, but greatly that we have been put together with three speakers. The three speakers are giving a deep dive talking about internet jurisdiction, Nicole who had to open up to speak by the internet global change and what are the threats and the trend that's going on. Prof Choi from Korea has been giving a very in-depth specific incident on the IP addressing cross-boundary and jurisdiction on this attribution. Closing that we have Prof Mie Mie, who's coming from Myanmar, talking about with all the different controversial issues and incidents, this topic relates back to the basic, how she has been taught from her class and the graduate school and as well as undergraduate school to the back to the basic on some of the internet ethics and moral development. 14 Not only with the three specific talks we also have two light sharing from two different economy. One specifically from Thailand here, the other one is from Nepal. So Nicole, like I said, she has been brought up this topic with very, very good introduction about how the internet, how the global has been changing, the economy. The different cyber crime cases, the different cyber jurisdiction cases that she has brought up some of it and then we carried out to the internet governance with the policy development and toward global standard and we are here at APNIC where we are discussing the issues like this, we are actually making the standards and making these norms together. The next Prof Choi from Korea, he's talking about IP addressing and cross boundary cooperation. This is not an easy thing to say, but he has brought from the global scale on the cyber attack maps into the difficult things about how to attack with the attributes and why it's making such thing a difficult to explore. Then we come to pretty much the consensus about that's the need for multistakeholder cooperation. Coming to in third presentation from Prof Mie Mie, she has brought about the internet ethic etiquette, the different issues on internet etiquette and the media and 15 the information literacy. All these issues are out there, but she put it so nicely together and then we talked about the skill and moral development. How is she being able to in her research lab to develop the skill and the moral. Those are the fundamentals when the youths are taking classes back in colleges when they go out to the real world that they have the best standards in there. So these three talks pretty much close as an exploration for the Cooperation SIG here to look into the internet jurisdiction. Then we have two light talks, the light talks are from Thailand. As we are here standing in the land of Thailand, that we know that we are moving to ward the digital platform with the digital economies and everything else, the fundamental infrastructure remains to be the very important things to be built. But with that, the cybersecurity becomes even a bigger issue, so more and more things we need to tackle because things are moving so fast. In consensus with that, Nepal, Bikram has also mentioned pretty much the same thing, so the changing world with the internet and jurisdiction that's certainly worthwhile to tackle to deep dive into many of the things. So with the five speakers that we had share at the Cooperation SIG, we are looking forward for all 16 your participation coming to us and let us know what are some things and concerns that you have with the internet jurisdiction, because it does come with different flavours and with different emphasis for each different economy. Hopefully that we can work together here add the Cooperation SIG that we can bring up the issues together and work more closely as the theme of the Cooperation SIG is for. With that, I close with a thank you for all your participation. APPLAUSE >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you, joy. Thank you for both the chairs of the Cooperation SIG, joy and Bikram is somewhere here. Thank you very much. We will keep on going with the reports and the next would be Kenny to my left here reporting on the IPv6 deployment. It's a report on the session that was conducted on IPv6 deployment. >>Kenny Huang: Thank you, chair. Kenny Huang. I'm going to give IPv6 deployment report. Since the last few years we did reposition from IPv6 measurement transition to reposition to IPv6 deployment. Because we think IPv6 going to take care of, so we were focus much more resource on IPv6 deployment. So basically we have five presentation in this 17 section. Including Geoff Huston IPv6 performance and the other different operators they introduce IPv6 deployment in Thailand and in Japan, in Vietnam and also in Tonga. Starting from IPv6 deployment in Thailand, presented by Tanapon from True Corporation, he introduced True Group all the network product and services and also brief history of IPv6 in internet from year 2012 until right now and also they have IPv6 development plan in the future. Second speaker from Geoff Huston, Geoff as you know is very good at doing all the scientific computation, so in doing the research compare the IP, compare the performance and reliability between IPv6 and IPv4, so he highlight some of his discovery including IPv6 TCP connection failure is 1.4 per cent. Which is considered much better than 4 per cent failure in the early 2017, but still not good enough. But anyway, a lot of case they are ongoing issues with IPv6 reliability in many parts of the world. Also we have IPv6 deployment section report, presented by Koji-san from SoftBank and he introduced mobile IPv6 operation and also talking about schedule. Government and major three mobile operator they eventually launch IPv6 by 2017 and also shared some IPv6 18 deployment issue process technical operational issues. Next one would be IPv6 deployment in Vietnam by Nguyen. He's deputy director from VNNIC and he introduced IPv6 development since 2011 until right now. Explain why and how Vietnam going to develop IPv6 also they finish National IPv6 Action Plan and going to have some future plan for IPv6 as well. The last one is Maile from Tonga Communications. He introduce the island IPv6 and also try to explain why Pacific Islands did not deploy IPv6 talking about what kind of challenge and difficulty to deploy IPv6. Also they share some motivation for IPv6 deployment in Tonga Communcation Corporation. Tonga are third on the APNIC IPv6 measurement adoptions in the Oceania region. So IPv6 capable should be increased by 500 per cent or more when fully enabled after they deploy ADSL and fibre users. Okay, that will be end of IPv6 deployment section. Thank you. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you, Kenny. APPLAUSE We have been doing IPv6 for a long, long time. So now we'll start doing an RPKI, so next is the RPKI BoF report. Let's see which is more exciting. >>Aftab Siddiqui: Hello, everyone. Certainly it's not a new 19 snake oil, so let me sell RPKI to you. We had conducted an RPKI BoF in the APNIC 48. Why we did this, so APNIC started a campaign on "Ready to ROA" with a very nice T-shirt in 2015, did some amazing roadshows and campaigning and trying to convince people to create ROAs. It worked really well to some extent, but still there's a big gap between the invalid and valid unknown and valid ROAs, so what we understand that we still have to do a lot of things, still have to do community engagement and convince people that why they need to sign ROAs. A little bit of history. Myself with some of my colleagues we have been doing this for a long time. We did the routing security BoF in APRICOT 2018, routing security BoF in APRICOT 2019. Before that, it was network security BoF. So with were trying to come up with a platform where we can discussing all these issues. These are the pictures from the RPKI BoF we did on 11 September. Very good attend dance, even though we took a lot of time from the EC, meet the EC cocktail, be people were still there. They prefer to skip few drinks, but are not RPKI. So it was interesting, very fruitful discussion. At the end of that discussion, we had this question for the 20 audience. The question was, well, we had some good tiles, we discuss few really important things for the operators, but there must be more questions. More question today, tomorrow, day after tomorrow, but and for that, we need a platform. That platform has to be, of course, put into the streamline rather than doing BoFs again and again and again. So for that, we had few discussions on that note moving forward, I would like to suggest before I suggest something I would like to say a vote of thanks to a few people who supported this idea. Dr Philip Smith, Simon Baroi, Dr Di Ma, Rupesh Shrestha unfortunately who's not here right now, but he's supported me in last two APRICOTs, to make sure that this moves on. And of course the EC was there in most of the sessions and people like Martin Levy, Job Snijders, they provided really good feedback so that we can improve it further. Here is the proposal after that session. As per the process, to create a SIG first you have to do a BoF. I think we have done enough BoFs. Then you have to agree on the charter. We had agreement on the charter within few folks. That's why it's now open for the discussion. Then you have to show how many people attended that session and how was the involvement. Most of the EC 21 were there, they must have seen the involvement and I put on the picture, so you can see that it was fully -- it was full at some point, so I can easily say more than 50 to 60 people were there in the room. It's enough involvement from the community to start something formally. So I am proposing in front of the community and the EC to make that decision. I said draft charter for routing security/RPKI/* SIG. I have no problem if EC or the community decide to make something else, but it should be in a scope which is defined as per the charter. So I have no problem with changing the name, but it has to be something realistic and close to the operational community. Over to the EC and the community to decide. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you. Do you have any more slides? >>Aftab Siddiqui: I don't have any more slides. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: I think this is a good proposal. But as usual, we'll call for a show of hands from the members here to proceed ahead with the creation of this SIG pending the confirmation of the name and formal charter at the first meeting of the SIG, when that convenes, so those of you in favour of creating a SIG that is focused on RPKI and security internet domain 22 routing, please raise their hands. I'll raise my hand. I'm in favour also. Thank you. Those who any this is a really bad idea, please raise your hands. I think that is resolved, that we will proceed with formation of this new SIG. Pending the name and formal charter. I think do you have any suggestions on the enter imstewards for this? >>Aftab Siddiqui: Yes, if I tell for the next meeting, if I may propose Dr Di Ma and Rupesh Shrestha for co-chairing with me, I'll do it till the next one only and then as per the procedure, we will do the elections and hand it over to the community. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: I thinks that fair until the first meeting where the name, the charter and the chair should be selected going forward, until then, the three of you would have the responsibility to get it through the process. >>Aftab Siddiqui: Okay, thank you so much. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: As stewards. Thank you, Aftab, for doing this for so many years. APPLAUSE Now we will do an open mic for 10 minutes. Earlier, I had to call short a bit, but I think we caught up a little bit now. So if there are any questions, 23 I mean, Aftab was trying to get to the mic earlier. >>Roopinder Perhar: I have got couple of points. The first point is on policy formulation. Why I'm raising this point is because of the various policies that were introduced today and the discussions that took place, set my mind thinking that is there something more which we can do, which makes the audience who's here a little more knowledgeable, a little more capable to take the decisions that are required to be taken. The thought that came to my mind was, which I have seen in bits and pieces in other parts of the world, is that once a policy comes to the chair of SIG, Policy SIG, that policy is discussed internally by them, whether it is acceptable other not acceptable. If it is acceptable, fine. If it is not, then it is returned back straightaway, no second thoughts on that. But if it is generally acceptable, yes, it has some value, it will help the community at large, then what they should do is they should send it to the APNIC Secretariat to give their comments on that policy. The reason is that number of bylaws need to be studied, number of rules and regulations need to be studied and a proper advice needs to be given on that policy to the chair. When in the meeting that policy is presented by the 24 proposer, after he has presented his proposal, the advice that has been given by the Secretariat on that should also form part of the information that is being given to the audience. That will help in clarifying a lot of issues and you will get a better response to the Policy SIG proposal. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you, we'll take that into record. As Sunny wants to comment, I would suggest that you catch up with Sunny. It looks like you are talking about improvement in our PDP and we thought about it earlier, so it's the right time to do that. I think you need to write a proposal just like Jordi did to improve the PDP. Can you make it short? >>Roopinder Perhar: Yeah. The question is that the Secretariat does clear the things, but then it is on and open mic the clarity is not there that much. What would be when it is given in black and white on this screen. So that is what my first point was. You can tackle it whichever way you want. My second point is among the financials. The slides went off too fast. I couldn't catch up to all the figures, but what I noticed was that the financial reserves that we are building, they are at 16.25 or 29 at the moment months. That has been I think standard, a general band in which it is still roaming for fairly 25 long time. It has not increased. Which sets me thinking is that it is not increasing because either we do not have any funds or we are not making allocations to it. We need to do one of them, so that this increases. The other question that comes to our mind is probably you do not have funds. Understandable. Also, the issue, one has learnt is that there is currency fluctuations going on. So that also will be affecting the financials. So my suggestion to the EC would be that and the Secretariat would be that please go into it a in a little detail. Don't let things slide beyond a particular time then recovery becomes a little more difficult. Even if some hard decisions need to be taken, please take it. Because financial strength of APNIC is very essential. We are in for tough global times. Depression is going to be there. Economies are going to get depressed, but we need to secure our organisation because that is what is supporting the complete number resources for the Asia Pac region. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you. I think that is always our concern and that's why I was highlighting that it is actually gone down a little bit this year. So this is going to be some tough work on our side, because as you 26 said, the Australian currency losing its value against the USD plus a bunch of other market pressures and does have a impact. We have been lucky that inflation in Australia has been very, very low, which has helped keep our cost at a very stable basis. But this is definitely something we'll be looking at and we look quite extensively for the strategic meeting. So you'll probably see improvements going further on all aspects of that, but very well taken. Thank vow very much. >>Roopinder Perhar: Thank you. That's it. >>Aftab Siddiqui: I have a quick one. I have one request to APNIC. I think it should be the EC that please review the APNIC training cost. Sometimes in some countries it is not realistic for the market value. It's very high whatever the format chosen many in years ago it's not working. It has to be reviewed at least to every two years or something like that. Some countries are really struggling to pay that enormous amount, so please review it. I don't have a magic number to give or a magic formula to give right now, but it should be reviewed by the EC or some financial institution making sure that the countries economy should remain in mind before you go ahead and fix a value. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you. I think that's a pretty straightforward to us to look at, so definitely 27 something we'll take that up and I would suggest you talk to Sanjaya later on. >>Jordi Palet: Thank you. A little bit in line with what was said before, something that is being done in other regions and I don't think we should need a PDP modification for that, if you want that, I send a new proposal right now. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: No, no, no. >>Jordi Palet: But I don't think it's necessary. Analysis impact. So I think it will be good if when the authors in a policy proposal and the discussion starts in addition to have hopefully a much better discussion and contribution from the community in the list, the there is also a review from the staff about if it makes sense, what is the impact and so on. I really think that as an author in all the regions, this helps a lot to have a much better proposal when you come to the meeting. So I will think really we don't need a policy -- PDP change for that. It's just the Secretariat invest some time in looking at that. Thank you. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you. I think earlier when I was saying this morning, we need to talk -- earlier we talked about doing the write ups and making sure that the process as we set a long time ago gets reviewed on a periodic basis, so we'll come up with something back 28 to the community to see how we can incorporate this lessons and make the process a lot more streamlines and easier for those of us or those of you who haven't done this for a long time to get in sync. So I see to more folks, nose to will be the last comments. >>Bertrand Cherrier: Yes, just to answer to Jordi, it's already the case if you need help to write a proposal,. >>Jordi Palet: Not to write, to understand implications. >>Bertrand Cherrier: Secretariat will always receive the proposal and if it's something completely undoable, they will tell you right away. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: I think we'll take this discussion off-line, not right now. We have one last question here on the left. >>Praneet Kaur: Hello, this is Praneet from India. Since we are towards the end of the sessions, I just want to mention something very quickly. So we had this session in the beginning from the treasurer Kenny and I really want to thank you a lot for the fellowships you have been providing and the entire couple and APNIC it is because of you all, your entire effort, everybody, the team, that so many young people like me are able to participate and join and know so much and meet such amazing people. So thank you so much. 29 APPLAUSE >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you. I think we appreciate the feedback and we'll send you a feedback form later on to get more detail feedback, but I'm glad the efforts we make towards welcoming our newcomers is taking giving us new blood into our community. With this close of open mic, obviously you can still talk later to any of us or to anyone from the Secretariat. We will now have couple of quick reports and then go towards the closing proceedings. We'll request Che-Hoo Cheng to do a quick report on APIX. APIX is the Asia Pacific Internet Exchange association. >>Che-Hoo Cheng: Hi, I'm doing this report for Toyama-san of JPNAP. He is the chair of APIX Association. APIX is the Association of Internet Exchange Points in Asia Pacific region started in 2010 and it's also a member of a global IX foundation. The reason why there is APIX is they have a lot of in common, they do the same business and have similar kind of issues, so the IXPs want to use the platform to share information, experience about technical cooperation of business issues and the solutions. Right now, there are five members on the steering committees. They are Toyama-san from JPNAP, from Japan, the chair, have I jay from Equinix, he's stationed in 30 Singapore, he's the secretary, Tom Paseka, he's representing NZIX, he's based in US, but of course NZIX is based in New Zealand and Vivin from Mumbai IX. It's also called DE-CIX India now, from India. He's the treasurer. And Rupesh from NpIX, Nepal. Between the last meeting and this meeting, they had within new member, which is from local Thailand internet exchange, THIX. Altogether right now they have 31 IXPs, members from 18 economies. You can see all the names here. And here too. Between the two meetings was as I mentioned new member joining and they had issue of membership fee collections, I think about doing bylaw changes to at least stop people from doing nomination or voting if they don't pay, et cetera. Also they are trying to do website improvement. They have a special working group for that right now. At the meeting earlier this week, they have the THIX to do a presentation about the peering landscape in Thailand, which was a very good presentation, and they also had Mike from CNX in Cambodia to talk about Cambodia internet exchange environment and they also address RPKI and so they had three talks from Martin Levy of Cloudflare, Tomohiro from JPNAP and Kittinan from BKNIX and I hope they would do more outreach for 31 the IXPs. There was also an interesting presentation from JPIX guy called Masataka and he talks about supporting JPIX members to connect to HKIX remotely, which is becoming a very new concept to connect to IXP. There was also Kitamura-san from JPRS who talk about M-roots in the region. I think it was attracted some interest. There was discussion again about the membership fee penalty et cetera, but there was no decision. One key activity that they will do in the coming months will be peering Asia 3.0. It is an open peering forum for networks around the region or even from outside the region to talk about peering and it was under the administration of APIX Association and peering Asia 3.0 conference will be held in November in KL and registration is open so if you running a network which would do peering, you're recommended to join, but first of all, you need to have AS number and you are really doing peering, because they really assess the registration. There's some restriction per network to join. Also, the call for presentation has been opened so if you want to do presentation over there, please submit your presentation. 32 This is the location and the website and that's it. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you, Che-Hoo. APPLAUSE I liked it how it said deadline is there, but it is still open. The next report would be the Women in ICT update from Sofia. >>Sofia Sylvia Berenguer: Hello. I'm Sofia. I'm a product manager with APNIC. I'm sorry I didn't prepare slides. But I just wanted to share a we can summary on the Women in ICT lunch session we had yesterday at lunchtime. It was sponsored by IPv4 global and we had the participation of Maz representing the APNIC Executive Council. We had around 100 people participating and with female male balance of about half and half, which was very interesting. The session was film and made available through the Facebook account of APNIC. We had some remote participation as well. It consisted on an open forum over lunch followed by the contribution of three guest speakers. Narelle Wakely, Mary Rose Rontal and ... Interesting the first part of the session, there were different topics discussed at the tables. Themed around the challenges that women experience in the ICT sector. 33 Then some summaries were shared with the rest of the room and we finished with our guest speakers sharing some insights from the personal stories. Some of the most inspiring insights that were shared during the session were about how in different economies, women experience different challenges, for example, in south Asian countries women are not expected to do field jobs and usually end up doing documentation work. While in Thailand the ICT sector is a female dominated sector. We also talked about mansplaining, which is something some men do when trying to dominate women, explaining something that women already know and may even do better than them. Also, a collection of some amazing advice was shared and I will just quote. Be confident and empower yourself. Don't be afraid to try. Keep failing. Have fun and try again. Learn by doing. Keep learning in things. Even when failing be kind to yourself. Worry less and enjoy life more. Listen to yourself and be true to yourself. Embrace the differences instead of trying to be more like men. Our guest speakers talked about the importance of teamwork to maximise everybody's potential and the importance of women networking forums and communities. They talked about how we all have a responsibility to 34 make a change and create the right culture and for that we need to take action by participating, being a role model or being a mentor, for example. They also talked about the importance of empathy when suffering from bullying and imposter syndrome. So I would like to thank everybody who participated. It was really an amazing session. Thanks APPLAUSE >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you, Sofia. For the update and the excellent organisation of the event. Now we go on to report by Tohid about the conference infrastructure. >>Tohid Naslpak: Thanks, Gaurab. My name is Tohid from APNIC infrastructure services. I'm not here to talk about what we do in APNIC as infrastructures ises, I'm about conference network. As you can see here, this is our conference network schematics. It's a simple network, very similar to other networks, two core routers, two core switches, bunch of other switches, access points, laptops and other stuff and connected to two ISPs. It looks simple, but believe me it's not, because the environment or the plain view of implementing this network is very complex. So we will see it. 35 Is it a really three days effort? Of course not. First of all, it's eight days conference, eight days event, five days workshop, three days conference. But it isn't just that. We start about 10 months before the conference. We do site survey, we go to the place. We visit the possible or potential hotels, ISP talk to the ISPs, the video teams, we talk to the host. Two months ago, we get things get serious, we talk serious business and finalise everything with the sponsor, hotel, IT, host. Also we do update IP geolocation and Whois objects of our resources we are going to use in APNIC conference. About one or two weeks we prepare for shipment. We ship everything. We don't carry it. We finalise configuration and eventually we ship the equipment. So normally what we are asking is we look for two ISPs, two different ISPs, which can they provide full dual-stack IP connectivity, so we don't lack tunnelling for IPv6. We always ask for full BGP feed for both v6 and v4. We love to have hotel with interconnecttivity to minimise cabling and also uninterrupted power to avoid outage. What do we use. With use two routers, eight switches and main wireless controller, another one as 36 a back-up and a bunch of access points. 20 in this case for this conference. Also, to laptops to run certainly services for internet. So you can see here this is the picture I took it before shipping the equipment. Our mini rack. What do we mean by essential services. We run bind 9.14.3 on two laptops for DNS, DNS 64 and DNSsec validation. We also running KEA 1.6.0 in HA mode for DHCP version 4 and we use Prometheus, Grafana, alertmanager for metric collection and also alerting and also we have integration between alertmanager and the stack. Finally, we also use nfsen for collecting NetFlow information on metrics. There is another thing we are running on the laptop. I'll talk about that later. This is a screenshot of alerting. So we have a slack channel for conference so we receive alerts and we act when we receive alert and we act if it's relevant. So we run bunch of services or just two laptops. Are they performing well or okay for conference with about 400 people? Well, as a matter of fact, I have the load afternoon 1 minute interval for the two laptops. It seems they are doing okay. So 0.1 or 0.15 is the 37 load average of the two. Internet resources, AS24555, 220.247.144.0/20, that's our IPv4. 2001:DF9::/32 that's our IPv6, which is sharing with APRICOT, of course. So we update the geolocation to show Thailand. That's where ... NetOX our new product. What about webcast? We use four AV mixers, seven webcast laptops, five web cameras, a bunch of other things, like cables, connectors, adapters. How do we carry this stuff? One mini-rack and 15 equipment boxes. So we ship everything here, we unpack it here, install it and today we are going to pack effect back and send it back tomorrow to Brisbane. Let's see some statistics. We had the maximum income of 387 WiFi clients, so we achieved this on the first day of the conference. During the keynote. If I read it down to different SSIDs, the normal WiFi APNIC-conference, be 3.15. V6 only WiFi 45 and the edge room 37. That's a bit more in the internet traffic what how did we use the internet up link. If I can read it correctly, 239 megabit per second on one router and 125 on the other one down. The bytes we managed to receive 1.344 terabytes of data at the same time with 385 gigabites we send out to the internet. The packets we managed to receive 38 1.6 billion and send out 900 million about packets. These are up to this before the lunchtime, the figures. Capturing from the nfsen or via NetFlow. IPv6 versus IPv4 are traffic, so about 20 to 30 per cent of our traffic was IPv6, from the conference. DNS resolvers you can see the number of DNS queries versus the DNSSEC validation on the top and the bottom the truncated responses and also the NXDomain responses. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Do you need to speed up, I think you are told to limit the slides. This is not a conference presentation. Please move on. >>Tohid Naslpak: We also had some people using external resolvers. I will move on. We managed to have 25 live YouTube and Zoom sessions, 14 of them with transcript and 70 gigabyte of information, video and audio being uploaded. Probably I just we had the Eduroam WiFi for the first time. And we had route origin validation for the first time in the conference. I move to here, so we were dropping about 1 per cent of IPv4 prefixes and 0.43 per cent of IPv4 prefixes in this conference. Still so much work to do to resolve the unknown ones. 39 Challenges, IP geolocation, wireless signal to noise ratio, ICMP v6 RA, the user distribution and coverage favouriers. Probably that's it. I want to say just this was a team effort. I want to give a big thanks to my team, the IS team sitting over there. Also the Le Meridien IT team, sponsors, internet sponsors, UIH and CS Loxinfo and AV team sitting over there. Thank you all. APPLAUSE >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you very much. I think the last 10 slides were the most interesting. So I think we need to fix that, the Secretariat needs to fix their own reporting. Thank you to the interactive for doing all the work. So the next presentation would be -- Taiji has something to say. >>Taiji Kimura: Taiji from JPNIC. Thank you for showing the RPKI data on the screen. Very interesting. Thank you. APPLAUSE >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Next I'll invite Dr Smith to talk about the next APNIC meeting and APRICOT. >>Philip Smith: Good afternoon, everyone. I think we're getting to the end of proceedings. It's time to start thinking about the next meeting. The next APNIC conference of course as part of APRICOT, APRICOT 2020. 40 So on behalf of the APRICOT organisers, I would like to invite you all to Melbourne in Australia, mid February next year. But I don't have any presentation to show, but before the AV team show a short video, there's one thing special about this APRICOT upcoming. It will be the 25th one that we have had. So we want to try and do something a little bit special, a little bit different. So wall tree and celebrate our 25 APRICOTs that we have had with the event in Melbourne. So I would like you tall to make a note in your diaries. The date is a little bit offset because we are squeezed in between two other conferences taking place in the conference centre. So please be very aware you can go to the APRICOT website. It's already there. 2020.apricot.net. We're starting to populate the workshops and the structure of the programme over the coming month. The fellowship programme for APRICOT will launch in October and we hope to have the registrations opening for APRICOT around about that timeframe as well. So look forward to an exciting conference then and activity we'll have been all the usual features, APRICOT peering forum, we have spent quite a bit of time looking at RPKI, writing security and so forth. Anyway, without taking up much more time, if you would please play the welcome video. 41 (video played) So the finishing scenes was floating along the Yarra River on the left-hand side is the Crown Convention Centre, we will be in the convention centre of the Crown Promenade Hotel. The visitor video is for tourists to come, but we hope you come to the conference as well. Apart from all the wonderful things there are to do in Melbourne and in the state of Victoria. Like to wish you all there to come and we hope to see you. Thank you very much, everyone. APPLAUSE >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you, Philip. Just for the regular APRICOT attendees, APRICOT generally is in winter, remember, this is going to be in sumer. Bring your clothes likewise of the it's going to be summer in Melbourne and it's going to be hot. So don't bring your winter clothes. If you're coming from winter climates, be aware that you don't need too many of your jackets. I'm looking at people from Canada there. Hope you still come. Thank you, Philip. We look forward to Melbourne. Now we have more exciting one, we are inviting the hosts of our APNIC 50 to come and do your presentation. We are going to Bangladesh, Dhaka, for APNIC 50. APPLAUSE 42 Our host for the meeting in Bangladesh is going to be ISP Association of Bangladesh, along with bdNOG and I'll let Rashed talk about it. >>FM Rashed Amin: Thank you, chair. Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. I'm Rashed Amin from ISP Association of Bangladesh. I would like to thank first to APNIC team to select Bangladesh for APNIC 50. These are great opportunity, this is the first time that APNIC would happen in Bangladesh. Past we did a lot of SANOG and bdNOG programme, but I think the bdNOG 50 it would be a big buzz in Bangladesh and this time APNIC 48 there are 64 participants from Bangladesh attended already, so we all from Bangladesh are actually inviting you to be in Dhaka 2020 in September 3 to 10. So we have not selected yet any venue, but in the morning actually we did the discussion with APNIC team and just it will be very happening place, the hotel facilities will be good. So the current state sir, I'll just giving some information to you about Bangladesh. The currency exchange rate is 1 USD to 83 taka. Language is Bengali. Some people can speak English also. Time zone is UTC+6. The weather is typically hot, humid, no need any jacket, actually. GDP growth is 7.9 per cent. 43 On arrival visa system, so from the selected country can get the on arrival visa, like US, Canada, Australia and/or mentioned here. There will be some visa fee, 51 USD and you have to also showing some papers, like possess minimum 500 equivalent amount of foreign currency you have so Ho them, some documents, have I must have the return tickets. There are some direct flights from different countries, Bangkok, Chennai, Colombo, Doha. So last time it was from Karachi also, but I think stopped recently. The others are okay. There are a lot of taxi services beside that you can find Uber, Pathao, Shohoz and Obhai. These last three are local vendors, companies. Those were just providing the services through motorbike and taxis. Some attractions. This is you'll find some places. There is place like national museum, temples, fort. You'll find the shopping place and you'll find mostly the souvenir, Aarong and some big malls, Jamuna Future Park and Bajungeram(?) . We'll see the video. (video played) APPLAUSE So I wish we would get a very good participation in APNIC 50 and we'll do, make a successful altogether. 44 Thank you very much. >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you. APPLAUSE A few things. We try to go to Bangladesh in APNIC 42, but unfortunately we could not. So we really look forward to going there and I also realise that Bangladesh is not your common country to go to, so you might have a lot of questions and I see a lot of friends in Bangladesh in the room, so if you could all stand up, even from Bangladesh, just stand up APPLAUSE Anyone have any questions about the meeting, about Bangladesh, find these people at the social and I'm pretty sure they will be very, very happy to answer everything you want to know about their country. Thank you very much. APPLAUSE One of the things the video reminded me is the Bengali music and the language is one of the most beautiful in the world. So if you're a music buff, you probably want to go there APPLAUSE You can talk more about it later at the social event. With that, we are coming quite towards the end of 45 the meeting. So I'll ask Paul to go and do the vote of thanks. >>Paul Wilson: Thank you, Gaurab. Apart from saying thanks to you all for lasting the distance, there are a few special thank yous here to those who have made the event possible. These days APNIC EC staff decide where the meetings are going to go and then we look for hosts and it's really important and we're very grateful that the two most important internet organisations are here in Thailand agreed to be the hosts of this meeting. So this is thanks again to THNIC, especially to Prof Kanchana who was here, maybe no longer and to her staff, Pensri and others. That again to TISPA, the ISP association of Thailand and to Dr Morragot and her staff as well. So they really did make this event possible and they really do deserve a big round of applause. APPLAUSE We have some top tier sponsors, Addrex comes back each year and they have been with us supporting this meeting a few times, so thanks very much to Addrex for that continued support. ByteDance is a new supporter, a new top tier sponsor from China and a very exciting company too with us for 46 the first time. So thanks very much to the top tier Platinum Sponsors APPLAUSE By the way, I will ask all of the son sores representatives to come to the stage after I have just fin,ing shortly, so that we can present some certificates and take a picture. In addition, we have got other sponsors and supporters, we had Google, True IDC, CSL, UIH, APJII, Paraqum, TWNIC, CNNIC, JPNIC, IPv4 Global -- Hilco that is, Larus, Internet Society, TCB and MekongNet as our other sponsors, so thank you to all of you for coming to this party. APPLAUSE We have a lot of volunteers who help out, so the co-chairs and co-chairs are volunteer their team and effort to be here and also to prepare for everything that happens here in advance, Sumon, Bertrand, Ching-Heng for the Policy SIG, Billy and Zhen Yu for the NIR SIG and probably the newcomers Joy and Bikram for the newcomers in the Cooperation SIG. Also to all our speakers and moderators here who contributed to the programme. Thank you all. APPLAUSE Dr Bhumindr, the NRO NC election chair; our 47 scrutineers, friends from other RIRs, Leslie and Marco; we Shaila the programme committee co-chair, the fellowship committee members as well as the programme committee members as well. Our ever trustee stenocaptioners. I guess Sumon might not mind me saying, he's one of the more difficult people to follow at our meetings. His mind moves so quickly and he speaks at a grand rate, but I noticed Nicky was capturing him perfectly, so that's pretty phenomenal. Sorry, Sumon, but I think you know. Thank you, Nicky and Katherine. APPLAUSE APNIC EC, APNIC staff who I thanked the other night, but they have also made this possible for all of you. I hope the members and community members who have here have got to know a few more of the APNIC staff who are here and I hope vice versa as well. The NRO NC, RIR colleagues, fellows and guests. Even who attended, we heard, we saw before how many from Bangladesh are here. There are 64 on the list from Bangladesh. Sorry to inform you you were beaten by Thailand, there was 65 from Thailand. APPLAUSE I think maybe given the distance involved, the Thai community would give it to you, so thanks to Bangladesh 48 again. 35 for India, 26 from Japan, 21 from China all came here to Chiang Mai, so thanks to all of those communities, to everyone else for making the effort to be here. Also participate remotely. So please do stay in touch with APNIC via these channels. We are going to present some thank yous to the sponsors now, very quickly, so if the sponsors would join us quickly up here on stage, we'll take a picture. Thanks. I think there must be some sponsors in the room. You know who you are. (sponsors presentation and photographs) APPLAUSE >>Gaurab Raj Upadhaya: Thank you very much. Thank you to all our sponsors. I think we are pretty much towards the end. Once again, thank you to all the sponsors who make our events possible. And I think meeting has been quite successful so far. We had a very good attendance. We had very good programme. I think RPKI won the week, if you're talking about v6 and RPKI, I think RPKI got ahead a little bit. But we still need to progress forward with other technologies like v6 and DNSSEC and whatever else. So that we can continue to make the internet secure and open and keep growing along with it. 49 I also like to thank all our EC members who work this week with their strategy planning session and through the EC meetings and we'll still be here tomorrow, because we still have work to do in meeting RIPE NCC board. As usual, I thank all of the participants, volunteers, SIG Chairs, co-chairs, speakers, who work hard to make this event successful. Also, a big thanks to all our staff and if all the staff could stand up, if they're sitting down, really appreciate all APNIC staff APPLAUSE Thank you very much. For all your hard work and all the effort that goes into this meetings. Having said that, I think we look towards the next meetings. As you heard from Philip earlier, next APNIC meeting will be with APRICOT in Melbourne. The conference dates are 18 to 21st and as Philip reminded earlier, we are on a Tuesday to Friday schedule outside of the usual Monday to Thursday that week. Still the whole week. The venue there is the crown program nard and the hosts are going to be internet association Australia. Coincidentally, they were also the hosts of APRICOT when we went to Australia the last time. If you still remember, it was 2006 in Perth. They were called WAIA back then and now 50 they are called Internet Association. The hosting organisation for APRICOT is now called APNOG. In the past you must have seen APIA. It's now APNOG. But APNOG won't be a NOG. It will still be APRICOT, so that is the next meeting and as we heard just before, the one after that, one year from now, will be in Dhaka, Bangladesh. So I officially close this meeting now and declare the meeting closed and hope to see you all in Melbourne. Until then, have a good flights back to your wherever you came from and, you know, hope to see you all in the social event today. The buses will start leaving at 6 o'clock. Thank you. APPLAUSE